The Past Is Alive - Interview with Clandestine Blaze

Hello Mikko! Thank you for accepting this interview. Let's start with your actuality, New Golgotha Rising has been just released this year, how are the feedbacks?

Mikko Aspa: I have not followed much of feedback and there wasn't any promotion do for it. Album has sold similar style as before. I think some have been surprised of thin sound stripped away from all effects.

On this new album, your approach is more primary and "in your face" than the 2-3 last achievements, what "was your goal with this album? Even if this term sounds "cliché", is that a sort of "back to the roots" album?

This is certainly sonically more common with "Fist Of The Northern Destroyer" than two previous albums. At the same time, compositionally it follows more what CB has done in recent years than in early years. So not really back to roots, but focus on core elements of songs instead of sound
tricks.

What is this "New Golgotha", this "New sacrosanct order" who is rising in? Is there any political overtones, or is there a larger meaning behind it?

Something beyond criticism, what sets values beyond humanist ideals. Song does not intend to go into trivial detail, but address to necessity of rejection of liberal humanism in favor of something greater. Means may be in spirit or physical.

Unlike many bands, we feel a real consistency throughout Clandestine Blaze discography, meaning that it is your inner self that expressing in it, not brief feelings. Do you agree with that? With hindsight, how do you see Clandestine Blaze entity?

The changes what can be seen in CB are also present in myself as person. When there are development in bands sound or message, it is integral part of what band is. I don't intend to "stay the same". It is what it is, without much of planning the details. Things usually emerge semi-consciously.
Clandestine Blaze has changed in many ways during the years, but there is nothing I regret. It was how I felt strongly at the time.


You recently get involved in two significant publications, which are "Black Metal: Evolution Of The Cult" by Dayal Paterson, and "As Wolves Among Sheep - History & Ideology of NSBM" by Davide Maspero and Max Ribaric. What do you think about these books and was it a good expericence for you? The number of book about Black Metal continues to grow, do you thing this exhibition is a good thing for it?

I was also briefly featured in one English book called "Black Metal - Beyond The Darkness". All the books was taken part just like a contribution to 'zine. I replied some questions what was sent to me. While books may be quite recent, replies may be c. 5 years old. Some quotes even older, from 15 years old interviews. I didn't know whether books ever come out and also didn't realize the magnitude of the books. If I would have, I would probably have spend little more time with them.
Books you mention, are good ones. It is impossible to make comprehensive or flawless book about as complex matter as black metal, but they turned out better than could have imagined.

In that particular book you are expressing your disarray regarding NSBM scene, its inconsistency, its superficiality. A very Interesting point of view, and not so singular because in the same book, other involved people like Alexander from Aryan Art or guys from Grand Belial's Key expressed the same feeling. Could you develop a little bit about it? Don't you thing it could be a more general problem, not particularly unique from this movement, but also for most polical movement?

I may be critical, but perhaps even more critical towards "normal black metal", so to say. There are both positive and negative sides in movement. In one hand, it's far more method of typical black metal to use anything of extreme nature in attempt to glorify negativity. Often to such a large extent, it will become trivial and detached from real meaning.
I don't particularly favor "conservative politics", but I have plenty of similarities with radicalism what seeks to replace modern world valuesystem with something else. I'd rather be critical for term NSBM, as it tends to be misleading in most cases.

Generaly speaking, what do you think of all these movements who deals with strong nationalism / regionalism / cultural identity in the Black Metal music?

I believe there is plenty of substance what walks hand in hand with ideals presented in black metal. I would suspect that for many, it is not merely admiring things of past, but about aknowledging that there may be fruitful platforms to create something new.
Already black metal itself is fusion of tradition and revolution. Such approach may be applied to life in general.

Since very early stages of CB, I have always stated that CB is not "suicidal" band. I don't value self-pity, self destruction or such to high degree. Opposition to life, requires also evaluation what is considered to be "life". If the opposers of life spend their lives focused on lazy comfortable downshifting, decadent hedonism, or careless time consumption, then it barely offers much solutions. I reject the lowest abominations of human behaviours what we call life. I don't reject life what manifests itself as more noble forms of struggle what separates men from worthless meat.

Let speak about your label, Northern Heritage. First, you almost do not advertise at all about it, but more than that, the label has the particularity to regularly re-pressing releases in case of shortage, to avoid any type of speculation regarding to the "first press" hype. I find this approach very honorable, especially because you seems to be the only label to do this. How do you explain it?

I am not interested in black metal as form of "collectors items". Some people have accused me of coat turning in cases such as making repress of something what was originally limited edition. Or changing method of advertising or distribution. Despite there barely are changes.
Important factor is to realize NH is not loyal to "350 copies", "paper flyer" or such trivialities. NH is loyal to idea of aiming to reach people who are able to cultivate idea of black metal. In times when limited release, utmost media black-out or such was suitable methods, they were used. These times something such as "limited special editions" do not work as method to reach black metal fanatics, but as means to attract collectors, dealers, status-symbol seekers, etc.
NH is loyal what I see as the core ideals of black metal. What are the means to achive it, can change.

At your scale, did you see a drop in sales because of internet and dematerialized problem? There is a bandcamp page for Clandestine Blaze or Mgla for instance, does people really buy dematerialized releases from you? If it is not to much to ask, what are your average pressing quantities for an album? Pure curiosity also, it is ok if you don't answer to it, but what is your best selling so far? The worst?

It was internet what made it possible to sell a lot of material very fast in first place. I don't consider small sales as problem of black metal. Perhaps the opposite! Many have used to idea that purpose of black metal recording would be to "sell albums". This has contributed to situation
where utmost worthless material is being released. Sometimes on scale of industrial-production-line, where some persons generate endless flood of generic material what clearly has no high impact on anyone. Perhaps not even its creator. It would be foolish to hope that once again every band or label should be able to sell 1000 CD's of such title.
Generally every NH release sells what it has been pressed, so there isn't any "low sales". If I expect demand to be small, I simply press less copies. Best selling titles have sold all formats combined 10000+ copies. Generally bands would be somewhere within 1000-5000 copies range per album.

Most NH bands already have site where material can be heard. Satanic Warmaster, Baptism, Mgla, Clandestine Blaze, etc..  I don't think it is crucial to make money on downloads. Files are free everywhere for those who don't want to pay. Payment changes nature of material one listens to.
With just random clicks online, one can be tempted to skip tracks if they don't have immediate effect. Album one paid for, is more likely to be respected. That one really listens it and tries to get into it even if it is harder to digest.

What do you think about the growing of social networks and dematerialized music (mp3, streaming) recently, with a paradoxical comeback of Vinyl the last 6 years, and more recently even tapes?

Personally I don't download music or have memberships in any music streaming systems. I think there are some uses for these things, but I also feel that a lot is being lost when someone spends their entire time surrounded by quick superficialities. I don't follow metal discussion forums or bands facebooks etc. It all appears to revolve more on selling/buying/collecting, but not actual discussion between people what would go beyond it.

Regarding Northern Heritage releases, is there any album who has a more special meaning than the other? Any regrets?

I have no regrets. One can say some albums have more meaning in context of wider scale. Effect on how Finnish black metal is seen or perhaps even contributed something to global BM culture. All releases have had a purpose and meaning. I do not sign bands merely to fill the catalogue, so they have importance to me personally.

If we just take a look on Metal Archives, in Black Metal, it comes out in one month what he went out in a year during the mid 90s. What do you think about this profusion? Do you think, like many others, that the quality lowered over time?

As said before, amount of material is so high, it is not realistic to think there could be someone who actually buys all of it. In most active years Finnish black metal alone resulted over 100 releases a year. Think of 2 new titles each week, besides tons of material from abroad. With this pace year after year, it would be impossible for anyone who wants to actually listen material profoundly, to follow it all. Some labels may have problem to take step away from consumer-culture and realize there should be other values than urgently proceed to release schedule of next month.
I do admit that there is some charm in temporary things. However, I'd personally hope more and value more something what is not instantly forgotten, but carry strength for decades. And also awake feelings and ideas.

The 2000s have seen the demise of many Black Metal label. While some still appear, there is less and less of it. Do you think they are made to disappear? Would you stop your work with Northern Heritage if the conditions becomes too difficult?

Harsh reality of music sales affects most labels. There used to be time when basically any black metal release could move 500-1000 copies on CD. Then it turned to be that sales were less, but at least one could spread copies through extensive trading. Finally a lot of titles are such unwanted garbage, they don't move even via trading network. Simply because nobody wants to listen these releases.

Everything ends at some point. We have no ability to estimate what will happen to prices or possibilities of international shipping. We are already in point where many items cost more to send than they are worth of. Such things may make things like "vinyl trend" completely obsolete. However, NH has no plans to stop.

Even as listener, I have listened hundreds of black metal albums. As long as I have genuine passion, it will go on.

You will make your first Clandestine Blaze concert next December, although in August 2014 you have made a brief appearance with Mgla. I remember an old interview from you, where you said not wanting to do any shows, unless it is a really special event. Nidrosian Black Mass is this special event? What make you change your mind?

Vast majority of Clandestine Blaze songs do not fit to live situation. I have played live in other projects for more than 20 years. I have also helped out several black metal bands as session member. During such process it is very natural to find out whether playing live is something to be done or not. This also belong to process where CB has shifted from "rational" to other direction. It appears to me, too many bands are overtly bound by aesthetics and creation of false ideological doctrine out of temporary necessities.
Already almost 10 years ago we tried CB as live band, but back then it did not feel right.

Special event doesn't mean it would have to be something quite extraordinary. It means there must be other motivation than money or "having fun". If there is gut feeling that something is right, then it doesn't need much rationalization. I don't feel comfortable with idea of big outdoor festivals. Or mixed-metal-festivals. Even concept of black metal festivals may be up to debate. Nidrosian Black Mass was still moderate size indoors venue with some bands I could associate with and organizers who wouldn't get scared of first little negative feedback but stay loyal to bands they have decided to take to fest.

People does not necessarily know your background so I ask you this question, how did you get involved into Black Metal? I know you have a big experience in noise and electronic music, do you have a "Metal background" like many others? What was the trigger?

I was listening to metal & rock music and always with hunger for harder material. Logical was to develop to thrash, death, black and doom metal. I was first editing underground 'zine back in '92 and it was for all the hard underground music. Time before internet, living in small town with not much people into this sort of things, mean that it all came to my knowledge little by little. Industrial/noise material was logical conclusion in search of sonic extremes. For many years I was mostly interested in hardest and most distubing noise sound. After some years I found bands that sparked my interest again toward rough underground (black-) metal.

In a recent interview, you confess regretted extinction of fanzines, as much as drop in CD sales. We saw the same in France. Why are fanzines something essential to you?

I come from era when fanzines were crucial. Almost only means of finding more about bands than heard on their albums. It is also continuation of idea of personal fanaticism. Where someone was so passionate about bands, he felt like these bands should be introduced to like-minded fanatics. I feel that when underground was filtered via fanatic domain, there was much more vital processes happening than in form of faceless promotion.
Certain amount of healthy elitism would not only filter out the worthless, but also expose cult bands beyond the hyperbole of label-promoters and marketing teams.

What do you think of the French scene, its evolution ? Do you still work with Deathspell Omega and how is it going? I understand that you were a big fan of the Black Legions, which band get your attention now?

Most of all, I like all the same bands what I liked in the past. From old French bands I have most recently been listening Vlad Tepes, Mutiilation and Kristallnacht. From new bands Caverne and Necropole.

The interview comes to its end. Thank you again for giving us some of your time. I let you the final words.

Thanks for the interview.

Interview: December 2015